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The BCDO Mutiny Begins

by: carolh

Tue Feb 06, 2007 at 02:56:00 PM EST



(More than 50 County Committee members from the 37th legislative district are urging Senator Loretta Weinberg and her slate of candidates to bypass the BCDO convention. - promoted by jmelli)

Below is the text of a letter dated February 2, 2007 sent to the Democrats in Bergen County.
carolh :: The BCDO Mutiny Begins
We proudly and enthusiastically support the reelection of Senator Loretta Weinberg and Assembly members Gordon Johnson and Valerie Vaineri Huttle.

We've known and worked with Loretta, Gordon and Valerie for many years.  We admire their courage, respect their integrity and trust their ability and committment to make a difference for our district and the state of New Jersey.

For years, we have been proud to be active participants in the Bergen County Democratic Organization.  It is now clear the Party has been hijacked by a few insiders who have abandoned the principles of the Democratic Party.  They have turned what was once one of the most open and respected nominating processes in New Jersey into a power grab.

Our recent conventions have been undermined with inaccuracies and falsehoods.  We had forgeries in Bergenfield, and attempts to bar long standing county committee members from voting while convicted felons were allowed to vote.  A court room hearing was necessary to achieve a fair outcome. Even in the recent convention, were it not for the diligence of a small group of dissenters, we would have had more of the same. Dissenting opinions were muted with barely a discussion and misleading "yes" or "no" ballots were distributed containing no amendment details. Finally, it was only through protest that a committee member was able to witness the counting of the ballots.

We believe in a fair and open Democratic Party.  We were elected to represent the voters of District 37.  The process has become so tainted that it disenfranchises the voters who overwhelmingly elected the Weinberg, Johnson, Huttle Legislative team.  That is why we cannot support the upcoming convention.

As District 37 Democratic leaders we strongly urge Loretta, Gordon and Valerie to bypass the discredited Democratic Organization Convention and go directly to the Democratic primary voters.  We will do everything we can to ensure their reelection.  This will be the first step in restoring the mission and integrity of our party.


Signers:

BERGENFIELD
Timothy Driscoll
Diana Flag

BOGOTA
Michele Rupar
Robert Ferro
Martha Reilly

ENGLEWOOD
Gene Backous
Charlotte B. Schoen
Nellie Bobe
Violet Cherry
Lorraine Cohen
Daniel Daniel
Sondra Greenberg
Horace Ragbir
Wallace Reid
Lillian Scales
Eugene Skurnick
Sandra Slipp
Walter Young

ENGLEWOOD CLIFFS
Ilan Plawker

HACKENSACK
Victo Geddis
Deborah Geddis

LEONIA
Chris LaBianco
Judah Zeigler

MAYWOOD
Timothy Eustace
Jack Savage

TEANECK
Gwen Acree
Brenda Allen
Ralph Blumenthal
Martin Cramer
Naomi Cramer
J. Paul Cunningham
Paula Dillon
Ellen Eber
Carroll Ann Grece
Amy Hausner
Almeta Honis
Monica Honis
Jacqueline Kates
Art Lerman
Genevieve Maiberger
Lizette Parker
Lou Schwartz
Mary Topolsky
Art Vatsky

TENAFLY
Shama Haider
Carol Hoernlein
Michael Lattif
Gloria Rouse
Patrick Rouse
Jon Warms
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Why? (0.00 / 0)
The battle against Ferriero's attempt to have the representatives from the 37th decided by people who don't live there was defeated.  The only message this sends is a lack of confidence that you have the votes in your home area.  How many election districts are there in the 37th?  About 120?  In that case, sixty is a majority.  If you are already at 50 with two weeks to go, then why not finish the job?

It is not smart politics to proclaim support for democracy only when it works for you.  One of Senator Weinberg's best assets is her reputation for being better than the "typical politician."  Why throw that away now?


I will explain (4.00 / 2)
The reason is because Ferriero has been getting rid of any dissenters since last year.  You don't have any idea how many CC members he replaced with his own supporters.  He already did his dirty deeds by getting Weinberg supporters actually kicked off the Committee by well-meaning Democrats who thought they were doing well by voting straight down the ticket. 

You don't understand just how tainted this process is from beginning to end. 

Only CC members were allowed to vote at the Bylaws vote.  With alternates, any convicted felon or whoever Ferriero wants to be there will be there to vote at the convention, and they only need a simply majority.

For the Bylaws vote, Ferriero needed 2/3. He almost got that.  At every single convention for the past few years, he has pushed the envelope and done many things to unlawfully disenfranchise CC members to affect the election. Just to give you an idea how messed up this is, the main person suspected in the forgeries in Bergenfield was on the elections commission.

We won the bylaws battle, but if we let Ferriero run the convention the way the last few have been run, short of having Jimmy Carter there to certify the voting process is valid, he will win the war.

The people of Englewood, Teaneck, Bogota, Tenafly, and now, Hasbrouck Heights deserve much better than that. 

I don't think you sincerely grasp the gravity of this situation.  This is not just a political discussion. This is a real crisis for voters in Bergen County.

Ferriero could lose that Bylaws battle, but if he wins the convention, because he stacked the deck at the Primary last June, he may win the war. I pray you don't live in a Ferriero town should that happen. 

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
Still Doesn't Make Sense (0.00 / 0)
What was the point of going through the whole battle about the bylaws if you weren't going to run on the line anyway?  It seems like it would have been smarter to keep the powder dry for the primary.  Instead, you win the battle and then walk off the field?

[ Parent ]
fighting for a principle (0.00 / 0)
I assume that certain things were learned by the Weinberg team from the results of the bylaws fight, but even if it wasn't used as a test vote, I think that it was a worthwhile fight for nothing other than the principle of retaining a system where the County Committees within a certain legislative district choose the party's endorsed canidate for nomination for that district.

That said, until progressives fight and win enough county committee seats to be able to have an impact they are probably going to have to run opposition slates in primaries if they want to have a chance at electing Democrats who share their values.

Hopefully, the 37th District will become a model for progressives in legislative districts throughout the state, starting with the 35th, 36th, 38th, 39th, and 40th.


[ Parent ]
Confusion (0.00 / 0)
I think it kind of gets lost in Carol's response, but what it seems you're confused about is the difference between the nominating convention and the primary.  I think what she's saying in her 15 paragraphs is that the BCDO convention is not as democratic as and/or more potentially corruptible than a primary.

But that's my read.  My suggestion to Carol is to be a little less verbose.


[ Parent ]
That's Not My Point of Confusion (0.00 / 0)
I throughly understand the difference between the nominating convention and the primary.  My point is that if you weren't going to have the local district nominating convention decide, then why fight the battle over the bylaws change in the first place?  That just seems to make the case for the opposition that Weinberg's slate couldn't win the convention.  Then, when the 50+ leaders go with Weinberg, they get thrown off County Committee too?

[ Parent ]
The condensed version :) (0.00 / 0)
We needed to win the Bylaws vote because the third change would be to disqualify ANY CC member from voting who last year supported Bob Stern in Englewood.  That was a LOT of people.  A lot of CC votes.  We did not plan on just walking off the field.  We simply have no other choice.  It is not a loss of confidence in our candidates.  It is a loss of confidence in the convention process.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

[ Parent ]
P.S. (4.00 / 2)
If there are 120 districts, the total votes in LD37 are 240, not 120.  We would need 121 votes for a majority.

Bringing the vote to the Primary would make sure the vote is carried out honestly.  Read my diary One Vote if you are not familiar with the BCDO. 

At the Bylaws Vote, our CC member from the 7th district was told to fill out his ballot so they could see how he voted.  That is voter intimidation.  It was hardly secret as it should have been.  I don't want to go through another election under the thumb of Ferriero.  I have been through 4 horrible county conventions where the process was corrupt.  If my duly elected legislators are at risk of having a petulant party boss try to undo the results of a fair General Election, you can be darn sure I will be fighting tooth and nail about it.  I'd want any election done openly and fairly.  How could you possibly have a problem with that?

Right now, we can't trust Ferriero as far as we can throw him. If we knew it would be fair, Loretta would have no problem subjecting herself to the nominating process.  It is just that 4 strikes and you're out.  Ferriero has shown he does not do fair elections.  He doesn't even make the attempt.

Also, ALL democrats in the 37th, not just those on the committee or Ferriero's friends can get to vote on either Loretta or Ken at the Primary if Loretta skips Ferriero's tainted convention. That could be you.

It won't be folks from the 39th, or the 40th, it will be people who are now represented by Loretta, Gordon, and Valerie to decide if they like how they have been represented.

And it is up to Loretta after all, if she wants to run on a different column in June.  Why are you equating that with being just like any other politician?  Do you think subjecting herself to a primary that is binding is somehow unethical?  Please explain yourself.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
I was under the impression that it would take more character (0.00 / 0)
to turn on her Assembly delegation then to stand by them and refuse the party line.  Thanks for clearing that up for me.

/snark

You have my services in the last week of the campaign should this come down to a primary.

If XT can convince his boss to get beind Loretta Weinberg in the primary, then the Congressman might earn himself the support of the grassroots should he run for Senate or Governor or Lieutenant Governor anytime soon.


[ Parent ]
Rothman Gave Ferriero A Hard Time Once... (0.00 / 0)
...He just may do it again! Only in this case the stakes would be much much higher.

If anyone can help bring Rothman along it's XT. 

I truly would LOVE to see Steve Rothman "take sides" in this battle and to choose to align himself with the Democratic wing of the Democratic Party! 

Come on in Steve; the water's fine!


[ Parent ]
Pardon me....Completely off topic (0.00 / 0)
Carol, Do you know Peter Karp?

Check out my 3 paragraph primer on Polywell Fusion.

[ Parent ]
Peter Karp (0.00 / 0)
Yes, he's a good friend.  I used to sing in his band Peter Karp and the Road Show. 

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

[ Parent ]
Yeah Peter is good peeps. (0.00 / 0)
LOL, small world. I 1st heard the Road Show back in hmmm, 2000..I used to manage a hobby shop, then bassist Danny Pagdon walked into the hobby shop, we became friends and Danny turned me onto the Road Show.

Peter is a truly gifted individual. http://www.peterkarp...
And lists you, Carol, as a guest musician
http://www.peterkarp...

Friggin small world, LOL.

Ok, sorry for the distraction.

Check out my 3 paragraph primer on Polywell Fusion.


[ Parent ]
Small world (3.00 / 1)
Talk about a small world, the first time I met Valerie Huttle it was years ago, when we played at her fundraiser in Leonia for Freeholder.  I sang What's Up by 4 Non-Blondes at the top of my lungs.  Boy, is that a good song for this whole mess. 

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

[ Parent ]
120 or 240 (0.00 / 0)
My apologies for the math mistake.  How many election districts are in the 37th anyway?

[ Parent ]
Go For The Whole Enchilada! (0.00 / 0)
As I've said before; ultimately, this is going to be Loretta's call.

Given the support shown above and the totality of the "situational dynamic"; my gut tells me that the Democratic elements within the BCDO are incapable, at this point in time, of successfully bucking Boss Joe Ferriero.  There are just too many shady/crooked connections to be able to muster a 50% + 1 victory in the convention.

If Ferriero were to fairly quickly and completely capitulate and state right up front that he is willing to endorse/accept the three 37th District INCUMBENTS as being welcome to run on the official party line; then that's great. 

In fact, such a humble gesture is probably the smartest most self serving thing he could do at this point as it would permit him to hold power longer.

As it stands now it appears that Boss Joe is too proud and/or too dumb to read the handwriting on the wall.

Rank and file Democrats do not want to vote for candidates who are beholden to a "boss".  That fact that they've done that in the past is only proof that they were kept in the dark about the true nature of Mr Ferriero's organization.

The ONLY way Ferriero can win is by keeping Bergen County Democrats in the dark and/or by keeping them distracted by utilizing Rovian tactics.

Turning on the lights won't be easy.  It'll take the work and dedication of many many hundreds of people throughout Bergen County to offset the millions of dollars this vampire will be willing to spend to keep his fangs deeply buried in the neck of the Bergen County body politic. 

I would go even further and say it'll take the work and dedication of every progressive Democrat in the entire region flooding Bergen County with thousand watt quartz halogen beams of light as the roof is blown off the edifice of darkness Ferriero has built over the county.  When the full light of day shines brightly over these creatures of the night; they will shrivel up and go the way of Richard Nixon  (if they're lucky and can avoid indictments).

In an ideal scenario, Loretta forms an alternative Democratic Independent line in the primary and runs a full slate of anti-Ferriero candidates across the board.  That's what it would take to get rid of this bossism.

As I understand the NJ "sore loser laws" any individuals who lost in such a primary would be precluded from running on another party line in the general.  In such a scenario, I dare say Loretta, Valerie and Gordon would likely hold their seats and...who knows how many other machine INCUMBENTS would fall! 

If ENOUGH light is shed on ANY machine candidate who is on the Ferriero team...that person will lose.  The BCDO doesn't have enough money to buy/bribe every voter if there is a truly MASSIVE turnout!

It's a shame that people like Ken Zisa who seem to be genuinely nice on a one to one basis allow themselves to become de facto acolytes of a machine boss. 

If enough folks join the Democratic wing of the Democratic Party/"mutiny" perhaps "Captain Bligh" can be forced to "walk the plank" and an all out political war can be avoided!?!

Whatever happens in the short run...the days of bossism in either party in NJ are numbered.  The people are sick and tired of being shafted and lied to.  Enough is enough.



You got that right! (0.00 / 0)
Nick,
Thank you so much for your insight on this.  You understand exactly what is going on here.  It is far far worse than most Dems here imagine. 

I just found out from someone who lives in Hasbrouck Heights that he went to a town meeting for the very first time because he was appalled at what went down when the Dems swept to power there.  They fired everyone - even volunteers.  Almost all the Dems there are Ferriero-crats.  Talk about Pay to Play - they then installed their campaign manager as the Borough Attorney.  This is happening all over the place.  Once they are in, they are like ticks to get out.

Joe Ferriero is our Tom Delay. If only the Republicans had the guts to get rid of him sooner, we would not be in such a mess.  As a Democrat, Ferriero is our problem and we have to deal with him ourselves.  But we have to deal with him.  His antics cost the entire county - every man woman and child who lives here and anyone who does business here will feel his reach very soon if he is not stopped.  Already he has used the county as his personal piggy bank -giving jobs in exchange for loyalty.  That is why the Republicans here don't stand a chance - we literally have no opposition party.  The one woman in Hasbrouck Heights who ran as a Dem switched parties AFTER the election because Ferriero did her a FAVOR (read county job).

It has to be the Progressive dems that straighten this one out.  If we need a separate column so be it.  I ran on column 4 last year and won, but ONLY because I personally called every Dem in my district to tell them what was going on.  We have to turn the lights on these Ferriero-crats.  It seems to be the only thing that makes the cockroaches scatter.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
Fair Lawn (0.00 / 0)
I thought the Fair Lawn delegation supported this ticket too?

Fair Lawn (0.00 / 0)
I know they supported a NO vote at the Bylaws convention.  They just may not have had time to sign the letter.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

[ Parent ]
Correction (0.00 / 0)
In Hasbrouck Heights, the councilwoman ran as a REPUBLICAN before switching parties to become a Ferriero-crat.  This was AFTER her election as an R.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

Obviously Boss Joe is Willing To "Hire" Republicans Who... (0.00 / 0)
...are willing to "suck up" to him. Eh?

Let's face it. The BCDO is little more than the Joseph Ferriero political "club".  That factoid ALONE should have EVERY real Democrat deserting Ferriero in disgust!!!

Hope to see y'all tonight.


[ Parent ]
unanswered questions (0.00 / 0)
Just how many Bergen County election districts (with two committee members each) are in the 37th Legislative District?  Is it really 120 or is that number just for the sake of the discussion? Is the entire LD in Bergen County?  If so, you can figure out how many votes you need and identify your supporters.

Depending on the numbers, you may be missing the chance to give Loretta and her team the party line if you "opt out" of the meeting that chooses the candidates.  Get the numbers first and count the votes! 

"Do what you can, with what you have, where you are."  (Teddy Roosevelt)


The process is tainted (0.00 / 0)
Dottie,
The number of CC members is about 240.  240 people to decide for Dems in Bergenfield, Bogota, Englewood, Englewood Cliffs, Hackensack, Leonia, Maywood, Palisades Park, Ridgefield Park, Rochele Park, Teaneck and Tenafly.

In June, Ferriero threw any CC member who openly endorsed Weinberg and Huttle OFF the county line in ALL of the towns I listed above.

In towns where we knew what was coming - like Tenafly and Teaneck, we kept our seats. In all the OTHER towns listed, many incumbent CC members LOST their seats to Ferriero plants.  Even if we count the votes, the Ferriero plants who got on the CC by a combination of chicanery and voter apathy, not honest campaigning, will be the ones casting the votes.  I had to call EVERY DEM in my district to keep my County Committee seat.  Not all Weinberg and Huttle supporters were so lucky.  The process is tainted from TOP to BOTTOM.

Weinberg, Johnson, and Huttle won 75% of the general election.  They are duly endorsed by the people, including Republicans, Independents, and undeclared. Ferriero is trying to UNDO the last general election.  Unilaterally.

Another line on the Primary ballot means it won't be just 240 of Joe's closest friends, but all the Democrats of the 37th voting. 

It is our duty as elected officials to represent the Democrats of our districts.  THIS current CC does NOT represent the will of the voters of the 37th.  It represents the will of the man who got them all county jobs. 

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
CC seats (0.00 / 0)
I hope you are starting to round up CC candidates for every election district, and laying the groundwork for the next primary!  That's essential for changing the Bergen County Dem organization.  The folks who got tossed last time may be prepared to run next time.  It will mean a fight but it will be worth it.

In the meantime--Loretta and her colleagues should win the primary, but it will take a lot of sustained and coordinated effort and some hard work between now and June.

Max Weber, the German sociologist, described politics as "the slow boring of hard boards."  How right he was!

"Do what you can, with what you have, where you are."  (Teddy Roosevelt)


[ Parent ]
Exactly (0.00 / 0)
You are exactly right.  One main hurdle right now is simply educating rank and file Dems that the Primary is CRUCIAL to taking back our party.  We have to get them there, this time and EVERY time.  That is when Ferriero does the most damage.  He takes advantage of voter apathy. 

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

[ Parent ]
Tonite - Feb 7 at 7 pm Bergen Grassroots (0.00 / 0)
Loretta, Valerie, and Gordon will be at the Bergen Grassroots meeting tonite at the Bergen County Ethical Culture Society 687 Larch Avenue in Teaneck.  They can fill you in on this evolving situation.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.

What's Needed is a... (0.00 / 0)
...new organization with its own headquarters/meetings/agenda etc etc etc. 

This way all decent Democrats (i.e. those who are offended by the machine/boss politics of the BCDO) can coalesce under a common flag and a truly clean slate.

Meanwhile, let's all take advantage of this opportunity tonight.


[ Parent ]
Bergen County BCDO spy secretly tapes Bergen Grassroots mtg (0.00 / 0)
Believe it or not, folks, we had an actual spy in that Bergen Grassroots meeting. What really cracks me up is that the woman had to walk into a building called the "Ethical Culture Society" to do Joe Ferriero's dirty work. 

The Bergen Grassroots meeting went well and Senator Weinberg was great at filling us in on the details of just how things actually work in local politics in Bergen County. And Robert Gulack gave quite a stirring speech about getting involved.  There was only one woman in the back of the room not clapping at all.  She had come to the meeting so interested in what we had to say, she taped it all for Joe Ferriero.  And from my sources, I know he heard it.

How nice.  Bergen Grassroots has really hit the bigtime.  Now I know how the Quakers and the vegans felt when the Homeland Security folks infiltrated their meetings and ate their cookies.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


Paranoia (0.00 / 0)
This is paranoia at its finest.  I know from "my sources" as well that there was someone from BCDO in attendance at that meeting.  Oddly, "my sources" also tell me that Senator Weinberg's staffers also knew she was there, and didn't think to label her "a spy."  By labeling her as such, you're indicating that she was not welcome, and you would have demanded her ejection had you known.  Isn't that exactly the type of behavior you're claiming to be fighting against?

When you equate the actions of BCDO with the actions of Cointelpro or DHS or whatever other hyper-oppressive bogeyman you might come up with, you do yourself and your cause a huge disfavor.  Why?  Because when normal people read this stuff, you come off as unhinged and unreasonable.  I think it's time to start reining it in and keeping the debate to the issues.

Here's what I really don't get.  Do you want a dialogue with those in power, or do you not?  Do you want a seat at the table, or would you rather wallow in oppression fantasies?  Would you rather have BCDO paying attention to what goes on among the Bergen Grassroots, or would you rather they ignore you?  You have a choice to make here.  Are you going to be taken seriously as a political force and demand attention or are you going to shut the doors and build up walls around your clique? 

I think it's fantastic that so many people have personally invested themselves in this race.  It's good for democracy and it's good for Bergen County.  This race, for the first time, has seen BCDO engage the New Jersey netroots.  That's healthy and historic.  So you didn't like what they had to say.  Fine -- debate and disagreement is also healthy.  But please, enough with the victimization histrionics.  It's unbecoming.


[ Parent ]
Humor-Look it up (0.00 / 0)
Personally I was glad that Ferriero heard what was said.  Paranoia is unhealthy, I agree.  If I didn't want a dialogue, I would not have posted the meeting time and place on Blue Jersey for everyone to see.  That is hardly shutting doors and building walls.  It was a downright invitation.

The woman from BCDO was there and welcome as was everyone who walked in.  However, taping the meeting and running back to Joe to play it for him says more about his paranoia than mine.  My reference to Quakers and Vegans and cookies should have filled you in that I was also joking. 

Joe Ferriero can be funny too, but I think at this juncture, he is quite a bit more paranoid than I am.

If you read the latest letter from Joe to the BCC about the situation  as to why Loretta is bypassing the convention you will also see that ...sigh.... once again, Joe is the victim.

However, what really must have freaked him out was our interest in following the money trail.........


One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
Humor's supposed to be funny (0.00 / 0)
Look, I'm trying to give you folks some tough love.  You're presenting yourselves very poorly online.

[ Parent ]
rein this (0.00 / 0)
The BCDO as it is currently organized and led is not something that can be engaged or debated with or be a party to a discussion.  It is not like a progressive Democrat could walk up to their local county committeeman or committeewoman who is dependent upon Joe Ferriero for their daily bread and try to convince them to vote against their own best interests.  It isn't going to happen.  This isn't a matter of agreement or disagreement.  Ferriero's followers do his bidding because they have no choice.

The only way that the BCDO will become a legitimate Democratic organization once again is if enough of Ferriero's puppets are defeated in next year's County Committee elections so that he can be replaced when the BCDO is reorganized.  Until then, progressive Democrats can only fight to protect progressive elected officials like Weinberg, Huttle, and Johnson.

There are no issues to be discussed with the possible exception of pay-to-play.  It is not like the BCDO has adopted a anti-abortion or anti-gay agenda, although based on statements from people like Paul Sarlo, it is possible that if the BCDO is left to its own devices, it could eventually adopt a more conservative policy agenda.

It is true that the Weinberg team was aware that there was a BCDO spy in attendance at the Bergen Grassroots meeting, but there was no need to bring attention to this person at the time.  It wasn't like it was a top secret strategy meeting.  In fact, my "source" described this person as a friend, which is the saddest part of this whole state of affairs.

Many, if not most, of Ferriero's people are good at heart, but like all of us, they have bills to pay and patronage jobs generally pay better than fast food or supermarket jobs.  I think that it is fair to say that we all have a price, but some of our prices are higher than others.

If Ferriero or one of the other party bosses wanted to offer me $250K a year for a no-show job in order to make me shut up about how they are destroying our party, I might just take it.  Sadly, for me to be able to sell my political soul, someone has to want to buy it, and at this point in time, it just isn't worth that much.

Then again, for some, maybe access is a high enough price.

This race, for the first time, has seen BCDO engage the New Jersey netroots.  That's healthy and historic.

What does this mean?  How are the netroots being engaged by the BCDO and to what end?

I hardly think that Carol or anybody else speaking on this topic is utilizing victimization histrionics.  We are simply complaining about the fact that their county party organization has been hijacked by someone who chooses to use it to consolidate power for himself and his cronies, not to serve the interests of the people of Bergen County or a progressive policy agenda, as well as the fact that the party is operated in an anti-(small-d)democratic manner that is antithetical to the values of its rank-and-file members.

There is also nothing that has been written on this topic that should make anyone view Carol or anybody else who has spoken out about this as unhinged or unreasonable.  If anything, the only thing that could possibly enable someone to come to that conclusion is that the idea is being presented by a credible and longstanding blogger such as yourself.  In fact, if you weren't so credible and longstanding, one could argue that you were a troll.

But since you are so credible and longstanding, that is clearly not the case, but my earlier question still stands. 

How are the netroots being engaged by the BCDO and to what end?


[ Parent ]
Troll (0.00 / 0)
There is also nothing that has been written on this topic that should make anyone view Carol or anybody else who has spoken out about this as unhinged or unreasonable.  If anything, the only thing that could possibly enable someone to come to that conclusion is that the idea is being presented by a credible and longstanding blogger such as yourself.  In fact, if you weren't so credible and longstanding, one could argue that you were a troll.

And here's the problem.  Everyone here knows me.  You know I'm not a troll.  You know I'm not carrying water for anyone.  But I know what happened as well as Carol does.  Her presentation of the facts as some sort of evil Bond villain-esque conspiracy is laughable.  And the more that happens, the more people like me -- people with longstanding credibility here at Blue Jersey -- are going to peel away from your cause, dismissing you as over the top and paranoid.

Like I said in response to Carol, this is about tough love.  Take it or leave it, but "rein this"?  Right...


[ Parent ]
Let's Chill... (0.00 / 0)
I can guarantee you that Ferriero is having a very big laugh over this silliness.

It was a public meeting.  If Joseph Ferriero had any courage at all he would have been man enough to have shown to the meeting and to have directly addressed Weinberg with any disagreements.  Instead he chose to send this lady who, evidently, recorded it.  Scott, who is the one being "paranoid" in that instance?  Eh?

Scott, the reality of machine politics is an ugly one.  Every one knows Ferriero is an influence peddler; that's what he does.  To some extent, that's politics: but the way he does it doesn't even accrue to the benefit of the taxpayers, but rather is great for all manner of patronage recipients, vendors, real estate interests, contractors, and pols who want his $upport to pay for their campaigns.

It's all about raw power, greed and fear.  I strongly suspect you already know this.

Joseph Ferriero is a particularly offensive example of political bossism.  He happens to be in our party (NJ Republican have more than their share of the same crappy "leadership"); but my party loyalty doesn't extend to supporting dishonest, unethical bullies who routinely sell out the best interests of the people of Bergen County.

Do I really have to make the case against Ferriero to you?

Loretta Weinberg may not be a perfected saint who has never done anything wrong in her whole life and Ferriero may not be the devil incarnate; but I sure as hell know which one of these two is relatively good and relatively evil.

I believe the ONLY way to EVER be rid of monstrosities like Ferriero is precisely to let their stink waft far and wide and to shine very very very bright lights into as many ugly details of their political dirtyness as possible. 

Ferriero-ism is why so so so many good decent people avoid politics like the PLAGUE!!!

Ferriero-ism is, in great measure, why so many people don't WANT to bother to vote. 

Cynical apathetic potential voters (who fail to register and/or to come out to vote) believe that "the fix is in" and, guess what Scott?  FERRIERO LIKES IT THAT WAY!

Ferriero can't really be negotiated with.  He needs to be extirpated from the body politic like a tumor (that's a simile Scott....I know Joe is a human being). 

Defeating a political opponent means confrontation and it means not always being "nice".

Scott, I sense that you see yourself as a moderate establishmentarian Democrat; don't forget that it was Jon Corzine who was involved in another DIRECT CONFRONTATION with Joseph Ferriero's "over the top" BOSSISM!  Thank God the courts allowed all the votes to be counted and Corzine prevailed over Ferriero....and Loretta was allowed to fill out the rest of Byron Baer's term.

I dare say, that our Governor wouldn't shed any tears, not a single one, over the political death of Joe Ferriero.  Do you doubt that Scott? 

Scott, do you really have a problem with the substance of what I've just said here?  Or is it just the intensity/style that you are not comfortable with?


[ Parent ]
Required Correction... (0.00 / 0)
When I said "It's all about raw power, greed and fear. 

I meant to say FOR FERRIERO it's all about raw power, greed and fear. 

For myself, and I believe most of the people who are members of this community politics is about the nuts and bolts struggle of working together to improve the quality of life for all people.



[ Parent ]
Point taken, Scott (0.00 / 0)
I understand where you are coming from, Scott.  Sometimes without inflection, written comments don't come out as intended. My humor didn't come through as well as it could have.  I know what you mean about hurting the cause.  But I haven't put on my tin foil hat just yet.  I don't feel like a victim.  I am mad as hell about attempts to disenfranchise me, though - as I've explained in dairies on this.

If I was paranoid, I wouldn't leave the house or even post who I am.  Now, having surgery for an aneurysm - that's scary.  This is politics.  And, politics in NJ is so crazy, if we didn't laugh about it, we'd cry. 

Most of the folks in the mtg room did not know the woman in the back of the room was from the BCDO although the Weinberg and Grassroots folks did.  So, many folks spoke openly - including me.  There was no attempt made to remove her or even to point her out or embarass her, and I would not approve of doing that if I had known why she was there. 

I appreciate you trying to keep me honest, but imagining a scenario and then lambasting me for how you think I would act is like getting pissed off at your boyfriend because you had a dream they dumped you.

One Vote. Yours. It really does matter.


[ Parent ]
tough love (0.00 / 0)
You've got to be kidding me.  Are you seriously saying that if advocates for Loretta Weinberg et al are a little too animated in their portrayal of the battle between Loretta Weinberg, one of the most (if not the most) progressive elected officials in the state and Joe Ferriero, one of the most (if not the most) corrupt party bosses in the state, Blue Jersey bloggers are going to abandon the cause of restoring the democratic process to the Democratic Party in Bergen County?

As much as many of the regular bloggers here who might have otherwise supported Camille Abate against Paul Aronsohn if not for some of the overblown rhetoric that supporters of her (like myself) utilized in our advocacy of her candidacy, I would be thoroughly shocked and truly saddened if the same were true in this situation.

And as much as I like Camille and found Paul Aronsohn to be Steve Brozak Redux, the only reason that an ideological battle like this made any sense is that neither candidate had a chance in hell of beating Scott Garrett in this district as it is currently constituted and I felt that the Democratic Party was best served in districts like the 5th if our candidates were inspiring and vocal advocates for progressive values and not self-described "pro-business moderates" who were afraid of taking strong stands on issues of concern.

But what is going on in Bergen County right now is a much different situation.  This is a battle for the heart and soul of the Democratic Party that, if successful, can be a model for what needs to happen in every other blue county in the state.

And if you are truly saying that Blue Jersey bloggers are going to "peel away from this cause" because some of the advocates have a wit that is more ascerbic than your personal comfort level can handle, the first question I would ask is whether or not Juan or XT or any of the other front pagers agree with you on this statement.  It would be good to know in advance so that Carol, Nick, and I and anybody else who feels as strongly as we do about this situation can mind our Ps and Qs.

You and I have known each other for a while now and for the life of me, I can't remember a single time that you have written something with which I have disagreed before this.  I also understand that you offered your tough love with the best of intentions in mind, but I can honestly say as someone who respects you and the rest of the bloggers here, that neither you nor I nor anybody else who posts here is important enough in the grand scheme of things to be in a position to lecture anybody about the style or tone of their advocacy.

Especially when you consider how rare true passion for ideals and values are in our current political environment, voices like Carol's and Nick's should be embraced wholeheartedly, not cautioned or warned away.  It is also more likely that if this battle is going to be won, it is going to be won by passionate Bergen County residents like them, and not by outside observers like you or me.

It would be one thing if someone like Loretta Weinberg asked for a cooling down of the rhetoric, but short of that, I think that advocates like Carol and Nick should feel free to contribute as they see fit with the choice of language that best suits them.  Who are we to tell them to do anything more or less?


[ Parent ]
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