But I See Your True Colors Shining Through

If they didn't have this "enemy", (0.00 / 0)

they might figure out the truth. Like:

High estimates say that illegal immigrants in the United States cost the federal government more than $10 billion a year.

The Senate estimated that wealthy individuals avoid paying between $40 billion and $70 billion in taxes annually and corporations evade $30 billion in taxes a year by using offshore sham companies.

Magicians call it misdirection. I can think of some better words for the real world version.

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by: Sidd Finch @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 14:28:04 PM UTC

Re (0.00 / 0)

I'd put in that the local ban is nothing but window-dressing, as well.  Federal tax laws already ban hiring people without proper documentation.  It is the employee's responsibility to show documentation (though it can be forged) and it is the employer's responsibility to check to make sure it is valid.

So maybe they need to look in the mirror if they are saying they have a problem.

XT

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by: Thurman Hart @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 14:39:47 PM UTC

One wonders ... (4.00 / 4)

... how many of these same "America First" (previously known as "Know-Nothings") protestors have had driveways, additions or landscaping taken care of by undocumented immigrants?

Don't anybody kid themselves. There is a nasty racist streak that runs right down the middle of New Jersey, from the Highlands, where "those people" coming from the cities are causing sprawl, to the tip of Cape May, where it is hardly unusual to see "The Most Endangered Species: The White Male" stickers ....ever-so-tiny.... on the back windows of pick-up trucks. They're tiny because they're meant to be seen only by the initiated -- they're sold by the KKK.

I've been at the bar of a public establishment in Stafford, Ocean County, and heard a woman exclaim, "somebody should shoot that n*****" at Jesse Jackson on the TV. I've had my parents HORRIFIED by a crew of a/c duct installers going verbally ballistic (the m'er-f'ing n***** got off!,etc.", inside of my parent's home, mind you, over the OJ not-guilty verdict.

Oh, it goes on. Nobody burns crosses anymore. Now they issue press releases. And they will run their fool mouths if they think they are among their own. As a "gender-typical" gay white male (which means, I behave on average more-or-less like most males in this society), I have had the opportunity of a lifetime to be insulted and bashed to my face hundreds of times, because no one immediately assumes I'm "one of those people." Not that there is anything wrong with it (which is what they say when you tell 'em right up front).

And, being a white male, nobody except fellow Irishpersons thinks twice about bashing immigrants in front of me -- until I tell them my grandfather was illegal. And since I have two parents, no one hesitates to tell me about the sin of "bastard" children -- which my mother, born out of wedlock, was tarred with her whole life, even after her parents married.

It's sad, but there is probably less real racism in Atlanta than there is in Trenton. The New South is here -- when the New North will arrive is anybody's guess. 

The big lesson for me is, you've got to call people on their shit on the spot every time. I can't change what they think, but I can get them to stop running their mouths in public. And when people stop feeling free to say these things out loud, children will stop osmotically absorbing their parent's prejudices.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 15:31:36 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Hey, let's be honest about it: (0.00 / 0)

There is no shortage of white racism in NJ. I know we are a blue state and perhaps where you live it is tamped down, but it is there.

We got 'em out here in the wilds of the 5th. We try not to feed them too much red meat. Just Purina Redneck Chow. Keeps them more docile and with firmer stools, but you don't want to let them out to run.

The funny thing is that the racist boneheads out here really don't have too much experience with people who have more melanin then them. Like this one little ethnic enclave, in the area, that I will not name. Some of the nicest people in the world, from an ethnic group that dealt with a lot of discrimination, against them, in the past. Good, friendly, hard-working folks, many of whom are racist as all get-out. Very strange.

The nom de plume has a long and distinguished history.

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by: Tandalayo Scheisskopf @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 15:28:55 PM UTC

Distinguish between racist and valid concerns (0.00 / 0)

It is necessary to distinguish between the ugly, racist and unjustifiable actions on the issue of immigration and the valid issues that need to be addressed.  If politicians don't stop ignoring the valid issues, then the racists will just continue to increase their hate campaign.  If the moderates don't take the lead in addressing it, the Pat Buchanans of the world will take over public opinion.  America should be a place where people from other countries can immigrate and have a better chance in life.  The problem is that America is no longer the land of unlimited space, resources and opportunity.  There needs to be a correspondence between the number of people allowed to enter and the number of jobs available, and the ability of the society to maintain decent wages and benefits for those jobs.  Recently a law passed the Senate lifting all restrictions on the number of H1B visas that can be granted to any person completing an advanced degree in the US.  So anyone who can get accepted into a Master's degree program from a not-very-good college suddenly qualifies for a visa.  This is happening when there are more than 200,000 unemployed people in NJ.  I recently attended an engineering short course and I was the only American student in the class.  It is considered *common* in the Southwest for people to be driving without a driver's license.  Such people cause accidents.  My rental car was hit by such a driver in Dallas a few weeks ago.  We all pick up the tab for these accidents.  Personally I have no objection to immigration, but I think it is out of control when it is considered *commonplace* in the Southwest for people to drive without a license, let alone insurance.  Politicians have to begin addressing immigration in a reasonable and logical way without ignoring it and letting the Buchanans and the George Allens of the world (the video is on youtube.com) take over.

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by: proud2Bliberal @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 22:24:26 PM UTC

Whoa, pardner ... (4.00 / 2)

Recently a law passed the Senate lifting all restrictions on the number of H1B visas that can be granted to any person completing an advanced degree in the US.

Really? I'd like the number of that bill, please. And, passing the Senate doesn't make it law. We've the House and MOTUS to get through.

So anyone who can get accepted into a Master's degree program from a not-very-good college suddenly qualifies for a visa.

What's your definition of a not-very-good college? Do you have evidence that US Masters programs routinely accept and then graduate substandard students? Please cite your references.

This is happening when there are more than 200,000 unemployed people in NJ.

And, of course, all those newly minted Masters from bad colleges in other lands are taking those NJ people's (mostly displaced from the manufacturing sector) jobs. Right. Except, of course, that the law isn't in effect yet.

I recently attended an engineering short course and I was the only American student in the class.

.

You carded them all? Or were they just "not our type?"

It is considered *common* in the Southwest for people to be driving without a driver's license.  Such people cause accidents.

What kind of people? Just any ol' people? (As we know, native-born Americans NEVER drive without insurance or licenses, and NEVER cause accidents).

My rental car was hit by such a driver in Dallas a few weeks ago.

And you checked his birth certificate? His naturalization papers? You're absolutely positive he was un-American? You don't state that this driver was an undocumented immigrant, only that he was an unlicensed, uninsured 'people'.

You know, in parts of Texas, there are persons of German descent whose families have lived there for GENERATIONS. That's why the accordion is such a staple of Tex-Mex music. But no one would assume an accordion-packin' white guy in leiderhosen crankin' it out at a Texas German-American club might be an illegal alien. Nobody. But those pesky brown people ... who KNOWS where they might be from?

Texas, FYI, used to be part of Mexico, which was part of Spain. Some of the unlicensed, uninsured drivers in the Southwest have families that have been in what is now this country for CENTURIES longer than mine has.

(The McGraths of Co. Clare: Pissing off America since 1925)

Personally I have no objection to immigration, but I think it is out of control when it is considered *commonplace* in the Southwest for people to drive without a license, let alone insurance.

Yes, there is a lot of racism in New Jersey ... you need to get your reality checked, dear, your xenophobia is showing.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 11:59:23 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

H1Bs - fact and fiction (4.00 / 1)

Recently a law passed the Senate lifting all restrictions on the number of H1B visas that can be granted to any person completing an advanced degree in the US.  So anyone who can get accepted into a Master's degree program from a not-very-good college suddenly qualifies for a visa.

Nonsense, as I suspected when I first read it. The total number of visas are capped, as always. Any one person can have only one H1B at a time (for up to six years), then they must leave the country for a year, and they they can get another. At this time, there are 58,000 H1Bs available for employers to use for employees with specialized BS degrees (AND fashion models (!) of exceptional merit -- may I vet the A&F boys, please?), plus another 20,000 for Masters and above, plus another 33,000 for Bachelors and above from Singapore and Chile.

Click here to read what the Immigration and Naturalization Service has to say about just how many H1Bs are actually authorized for FY 2006 AND FY 2007.

The H1B program has virtually no impact on overall unemployment in New Jersey, except perhaps in certain specialized fields, such as, say, telecommunications engineering? Where, sadly, what's left of AT&T, Lucent, Avaya, Telcordia/Bellcore, etc. prefer to hire nice young men with shiny new degrees and all the latest skill sets and low salary requirements that are going to go away in six years and never collect a pension or get too very sick while on their dime. Or, as my grandmother famously said, "It's hell to get old." But older engineers are competing not just with H1B holders but with the cream of America's technically inclined youth, too -- and hasn't it always been true that engineers who fail to move into management get left on the shelf as times and technologies move on?

I feel your pain -- but I wholly and totally disagree that it is in any way due to H1B workers. I worked with an H1B worker once. She had a really funny accent, and her religion caused some friction with me, but we worked it out okay. She was a nice Irish girl from Protestant Belfast ... yes, yes, and the Brit technical writer whose husband worked for Rover/Sterling -- his company cars kept catching fire ... she was nice, too! And the Dutch woman at the PR agency in Plainsboro ...  my point? H1B workers aren't legion, and they aren't easily identifiable by external cues, either. Blaming NJ's unemployment problems on "those people" is crap, pure and simple. Just how many of NJ's unemployed have BS degrees, I wonder? Surely not all 200,000 ... probably not even 10 percent.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 13:30:06 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Public policy criticism is not xenophobia (4.00 / 1)

I have the highest regard and respect for other cultures and I think people should be able to come to the US to have a better life.  I do not believe in racist views, attacks or prejudices against anyone.  But the current policies are going beyond compassion into the realm of chaos.  No, you cannot throw the prejudice label on anyone who states that immigration policy needs analysis.  Yes, immigration IS taking away jobs from people who are already here and the politicians are refusing to listen.  The minorities already here are the people being damaged the most.  There are not enough good jobs with benefits and a decent wage.  There is not enough room in many areas to continually build housing.  Housing prices are skyrocketing.  When there is immigration, there has to be an organized policy and plan for absorbing new workers.  When there is immigration, it should be done in an organized way in which people have access to getting a driver's license and there is some type of insurance pool providing insurance for low income drivers.  The current situation is chaos. Under the newly passed Senate immigration bill, anyone in France or Germany who can't find a job can go through a gut Master's degree program here and immediately be available to displace someone already here from a job.  The European Union is not reciprocal in giving out work visas to Americans.  That policy is not the same as offering humanitarian aid to people trying to escape from oppressive living conditions.  There needs to be some listening and not labelling as prejudiced anyone who voices any concern about immigration.  Re Dennis' questions about the class I took, I did get to know the other people and they were all raised in other countries.  We are not bringing our American students up the pipeline into science and technology at desired proportions and graduate schools are accepting foreign students rather than taking the American public school students as they are and building them up from the place they are at educationally.  Yes, I do consider it a problem when Americans are blocked out of opportunities.

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by: proud2Bliberal @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 13:20:34 PM UTC

CITE THE SENATE BILL NUMBER, PLEASE (0.00 / 0)

I am a master of web searching, and I find no evidence whatever that such a bill exists; and even if it did, it still has to pass the house and the MOTUS. IT AIN'T LAW YET. And the total number of H1Bs is capped, AS ALWAYS.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 13:33:13 PM UTC

More on the Bill (0.00 / 0)

Oh, it's part of the Senate Immigration bill, not a special H1B bill ... that's why I couldn;t find it. It STILL doesn't do what you assert it does, which was to make any foreign citizen who holds an MS from a US school eligible for an HB1. It just raises the liit to 115,000 per fiscal year ... which is what it was three or four years ago.

Click here for an IT-related news report.

You really are making a lot of simply factually wrong assertions, or ones that cannot be proved true or false, in the name of needing a comprehensive, coordinated policy to deal with undocumented immigrants. And you're right, we need that. But conflating engineering classrooms full of "foreigners" with entire regions overrun with persons guilty of "driving while Latino" tells me way more about you than I ever wanted to know. I'm tryuing not to be rude, but as I said somewhere else, I don't let people pump arrant nonsense (that's not the first locution I chose) into the air without calling them on it.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 13:44:33 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Geez, dennis. (0.00 / 0)

It takes me about twenty minutes to write a four line response. You just shoot out multi-sourced, well formatted and though out responses in what seems like two minutes. Do you have this stuff all pre-written somewhere?

Thank you so much for your valuable insight.

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by: Sidd Finch @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 14:13:57 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

but the point should be noted (0.00 / 0)

Obviously what's going on is a coupling of people with genuine concerns about the effect of illegal immigration on our borders, economy and taxes with racism.  The former are genuine concerns and though people are expressing them in bigoted ways and acting like jerks about it, the underlying policy still warrants being examined. 

Just b/c the messenger is an A** doesn't mean that the message should not be considered (the message being that immigration policies need to be looked at for security and fiscal reasons.) 

I paid for much of my undergraduate education by managing a restaurant and every single person in my kitchen presented identification when hired, but I'd venture to guess that at least half of them were illegal.  I have no idea how they got the identificaton for W2's and I-9's, but they did. Now, they were good people and good friends and they were not going to blow any buildings up.  But if they got into the country, why couldn't someone with a more sinister goal get in?

The conditions in which many illegal immigrant live upon entering the country is awful.  One man I worked with broke his leg and had to set it himself b/c he had no health insurance and was afraid of being deported if he went for charity care and somebody found out he was illegal.

The reality is that the system needs to be looked at. It's a shame that the people driving this effort are racist idiots, but take away the foul language and bigotry and the fact remains that something must be done about the current system.

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by: morrisdem @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 17:09:18 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Wildwood Confederate junk (0.00 / 0)

I saw this same link posted over several blogs a few weeks back, and since I had a first trip to Wildwood planned this summer, I thought I would seek out this particular place when I got there.

First of all, like many things in Wildwood, this particular store was staffed with people who seemed Russian. And while the confederate stuff can be offensive, it's also laughable, and most of it seems to be about adopting some lame "rebel" pose, and not about bringing back slavery. None of the black people I saw wandering the boardwalk seemed particularly offended or threatened by these shirts. This store also featured a shirt with Bush with devil horns, and more pot humor than any other stand I went to (one shirt had a "baked" Charlie Brown smiling and smoking pot).

In other words, let's not get too carried away over these stupid, crudely drawn, cheap t-shirts. Their message, like most of that "Southern Rebel" posing, seems oddly impotent. There are bigger fish to fry.

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by: Blue Demon @ Tue Aug 22, 2006 at 20:14:34 PM UTC