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The politics of John Adler's vote, and why I don't want to hear him defended

by: Hopeful

Sat Mar 27, 2010 at 06:39:20 PM EDT



Politicker NJ has a notable quote about John Adler by Democratic State Chairman John Wisniewski (in an interview that otherwise focuses on bashing Christie's terrible budget choices) that defends Adler's no vote on health care reform:

"I certainly in my legislative district feel comfortable making the case healthcare reform - for the reform the House adopted," Wisniewski added. "I believe John Adler made the right decision for his district. He knows his district."

Obviously, Wisnewski wants us to understand this as just another vote. It's not unusual, after all, to see members feel pressure. Democrats have picked up Republican votes in swing districts this way from time to time. So we hear that it is just necessary politics, and it's the voters' fault after all. Adler is admirable for siding with the Republicans in his district. Even if Wisnewski doesn't really believe this, he surely thinks his job to publicly support his incumbents. Political parties, after all, are as much about a group gathering and holding onto power as they are about advancing some noble principles.

But principles do come into it, especially for ordinary voters and the activists who make up "the base." The Democratic base is very unhappy with John Adler, because this wasn't just another vote. We all know the Republicans decided to oppose a moderate bill to destroy Barack Obama's Presidency and the Democratic Congress, openly admitting that they aimed to make it his "Waterloo." Meanwhile, Democrats, as Ted Kennedy's beautiful memoir reminded us, have been fighting for universal health care for over a generation, and Obama and Adler promised health care reform in their campaigns. In this context, for Adler to join the other side and attack the bill was an astonishing betrayal. (Let me say, too, that his announcements in both votes came while we know frantic negotiations with Stupak et al. to round up votes were still going on; I believe Adler was not "released" by leadership.)

Perhaps Wisniewski would think we're worrying too much about a bill, that after all, passed anyway. But I would remind him, and any other party leaders, of the tremendous disasters of the last decade. You see, to the people who vote and volunteer Democratic, from 2000-2008, and even earlier, the disasters were not solely due to Republicans. Democrats acquiesced as Republicans lead us into those disasters. Some Democrats in Congress voted to invade Iraq, not only due to their "districts" but many because they thought it would help their presidential campaigns! Some Democrats voted for the Bush tax cuts that wrecked our finances. Some Democrats voted to dismantle the system of financial regulation that had served us since the New Deal (I include the 1990s votes here) returning us to the pre-FDR world of financial panics every decade. Democrats voted to curtail civil liberties. They agreed to torture detainees and bypass the court system. In short, Republican administrations have easily found Democrats to go along with every lousy, disastrous, extreme conservative idea they could dream up. (Only on privatizing Social Security in 2005 did Nancy Pelosi finally keep Democrats together to say no, or rather, "Never. Is never good enough for you?")

And so, I fear, and I suspect many in the base fear, that John Adler has shown that the lessons he learned from the Bush (43) Administration is that the cowardly Democrats, the Democrats who voted with the conservatives, were the smart ones. This is why, I think, Adler's no vote on health care reform is even worse than a vote to abandon one core principle and undermine his party's President. if John Adler remains in Congress long enough, and finds himself in Congress with a Republican Administration, for all I know he'll be voting to invade Iran, end the inheritance tax, deregulate the banks, or give Social Security to Wall Street. It could be any crazy conservative idea, because "It's the right thing for his district." I definitely don't want Republican Jon Runyan to win. I'm even putting my time into that. But the truth is, I no longer really want Adler to win.

Blue Jersey readers, what do you think? Am I too harsh? Do you feel otherwise? Should Wisniewski defend Adler's vote?

Hopeful :: The politics of John Adler's vote, and why I don't want to hear him defended
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I just do not think (0.00 / 0)
I can vote for Adler and I know many other Democrats who feel the same as I.

Pissing on your base is always a loser move.


Yes, but... (4.00 / 1)
...elections are about the choices we have, not the choices we want.  Your choices are Adler or Murphy/Runyan.  As bad as Adler has been, he is better than Murphy/Runyan would be.  It is a no-brainer.

That said, all I am advocating for is that people vote for John Adler.  I don't think that anyone should contribute a moment or a penny to his re-election campaign.  That, he definitely does not deserve.


[ Parent ]
I know but I can't (0.00 / 0)
get pass his betrayal of us. I mean he betray us. I will not vote for a Republican, but I don't know, if I can vote for Adler.


[ Parent ]
No, it's not a no-brainer. (3.67 / 3)
It's a no-brainer that Adler would be better than Runyon But an Adler victory would have a long-term negative effect on how Democratic Congresscritters view their jobs. Sometimes you have to make local sacrifices for the global good.

[ Parent ]
Maybe you need to think! (0.00 / 0)
it's a matter of choices ... and a non-vote for Adler is a vote for Murphy/Runyan! Is that what you want?

Clearly we don't want the neo-cons! that being said, we give Adler a chance to redeem himself or primary him next time!

To lose the 3rd CD would be a disaster to the President and Speaker Pelosi ... Do you really want Boehner as Speaker? Hell NO!!!

Choices ... we must look at the big picture and we should give Adler a chance to redeem himself. You might have a pleasant surprise!

Babs

"Discrimination caused by ignorance and fear is a tax on human progress" - Barbra Casbar Siperstein


[ Parent ]
Adler (4.00 / 1)
Babs, I don't believe John Adler believes he needs to redeem himself. That's clearly part of the problem, for many of his voters.  

It's not a particularly snappy signature, but here's what I think we need in the next NJ Democratic State Chair.  

[ Parent ]
I think you'll see (0.00 / 0)
Some progressive action from him!

don't write him off!

"Discrimination caused by ignorance and fear is a tax on human progress" - Barbra Casbar Siperstein


[ Parent ]
Would you feel this way if he was anti-ENDA? (4.00 / 1)
For the same reasons that Steve Sweeney cannot be given a pass for the votes that he and his fellow South Jersey State Senators (other than Jim Whelan, of course) cast against marriage equality just because they might be on the right side of the current budget battle (for now - I predict that when push comes to shove, they will cave on the millionaire's tax), John Adler cannot be given a pass for his vote against healthcare reform just because he is good on ENDA.

Progressives have to stand together on a wide range of issues, not just those that benefit a sector of the progressive community, which includes, but is not limited to the LGBT community.  But even if we did want to give him a pass since healthcare reform passed without his vote, he is going to lose this November and lose big.  He benefitted from massive turnout due to the Presidential election in 2008 that is simply not going to be there in 2010.

The fact that he has cast the awful votes that he has is just going to make this situation even worse, not better.  I'm writing him off, primarily because he has been a disappointment as a Congressman, but also because he is doomed to lose in November, and when he does, I am not going to shed a tear for him and the end of his political career.


[ Parent ]
I don't think that you were harsh enough (0.00 / 0)
I definitely don't want Republican Jon Runyan to win. I'm even putting my time into that. But the truth is, I no longer really want Adler to win.

Why would you contribute a moment or a penny to help John Adler?  Aren't you in LoBiondo's district?  I assume that he will have some token opposition.  Helping someone who has no chance in hell of winning, but stands for something, is far better than helping someone who has no chance in hell of winning and doesn't stand for anything.

As far as Wisniewski is concerned, I think that this is another strike against him.  While the party should be invested in re-electing its incumbents, it has to be even more invested in standing for something.  As is, it is unclear what, if anything, the NJDSC stands for and the Chairman did not change that much, if at all, with this statement.

I am actually more bothered by Wisniewski's statement than Adler's vote.


I made a blog (0.00 / 0)
It's not much of an effort and it helps me learn more about Runyan.  

I do think my LoBiondo blog is pretty good.  

As for the election, barring an unexpected development with Lobiondo, I think I will spend my actual volunteer time on my local elections: borough and county.  

Frank LoBiondo Record and Jon Runyan Watch


[ Parent ]
great work (0.00 / 0)
I am sure that your blog will be even more helpful when we are trying to beat Runyan in 2012 and I have no doubt that the time you spend in your town and county will be well worth it.

[ Parent ]
Betrayed! (3.00 / 1)
I (unfortunately) live in the 3rd district and have let Adler's office know that I will never vote for him again.  I stayed  up late on election night watching the results in the 3rd (and well into Wednesday) and was elated that I finally would have a decent representative in Congress.  Now I feel like a total fool.

I don't want Runyon, but a vote for Adler is now out of the realm of possibility.  I will no longer vote for any candidate that takes my vote for granted.  And that goes for state Senator James Beach, too.

My only hope now is that Cherry Hill is gerrymandered from the 3rd (it's the only Camden county municipality in the district) and into the 1st.  I'd be proud to vote for Rob Andrews.


Exactly! (0.00 / 0)
Betrayed, it's as if my husband or I could have written the exact same comment. We feel the same (except we're not in Cherry Hill).

I'm trying to understand why the democrats in 3 aren't going to put a primary challenge against Adler. Why is it assumed that it will be Adler vs. Runyan or whomever the republicans nominate? Why even give him another chance?

From where I'm sitting Adler rode Obama's coat tails to get elected, and he's riding Christie's to keep the job. I can't vote for Runyan, but I'll sit home in November or vote an independent. I will not pull a lever next to Adler's name.


[ Parent ]
Adler (0.00 / 0)
While I feel betrayed by Adler, I will probably end up voting for him, knowing he will lose.  I wish there were a viable Democratic challenge to him, though.

Needless to say, any contributions will not go to Adler, but will go to Democrats in tough campaigns who DID vote for the people.

Blog: http://www.deciminyan.org


[ Parent ]
The 3rd district (0.00 / 0)
The Third district really isn't that conservative anymore, now that you think about it.

We have Cherry Hill, of course, but we also have the River towns (basically, a lot like the streetcar suburbs of Camden county which are basically East Philadelphia), we have fast growing suburban Mount Laurel and Evesham Townships which have been liberalizing with Philadelphia transplants, and we also Mount Holly and surrounding towns (very economically diverse), as well as Pemberton (which even went for Corzine).

We also have the fact that Runyan once played for the Eagles and that Ocean County (where's he's gonna need lots of votes) is Giants County. Eagles fans especially feel no love in Toms River!!!

He did not need to oppose healthcare. Hell, Adler is a cosponsor of ENDA and that took serious bravery, given that Ocean County is teabag country.

-Jordan O

http://pinelandsprogressive.blogspot.com


[ Parent ]
It's like being cheated on (4.00 / 3)
you can try to forgive and forget and "move on" but in the absence is mutual trust and affection, it's hard to accept and it's really painful.  that's how i see it.

you can't un-curdle something.

activist for hire.Follow jay_lass on Twitter


It's not just 1 vote that's the issue... (3.50 / 2)
This was the President's signature issue, and Adler had the balls to vote No on every roll call related to it. Even the reconciliation bill, which made the package "cheaper" and more attractive to the Blue Dogs. I have to say, I'm much less ticked off at Bart Stupak and his ilk, who recognized the historic importance of getting something done and were willing to deal.

And I have to say I found his arguments unpersuasive - doesn't bend the cost curve enough? Too expensive for small businesses? Well, then either work to amend the bill before passage, or work on subsequent acts to improve it. You don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. The fact is, he's a fair-weather Dem who's more concerned with staying in office in a GOP district than with doing the right thing.

According to an iPhone app I have, Adler votes with the party 91+% of the time. Not good enough if he's not with us on the big things.

I'm not voting for him in November, and will support any primary challenger to him. The fact is, we all say we don't want Runyan but, to be fair, if Adler votes with the GOP on anything of substance, there isn't any real difference, is there?

And, I'd rather have my picture taken with a former Iggle than with a traitor to his party and its principles.

Here's praying that the Administration and the DNC hang Adler out to dry.


Adler/Runyan (0.00 / 0)
Of course I would never vote for Adler's opponent. In his district Adler doesn't stand a chance of prevailing absent very strong support from the Democratic base. He won't have it, He's toast. On the other hand Runyan has the potential to be such a disaster in 2 years hopefully we can have a real democrat for a challenge. Let's start laying that groundwork now and not waste resources and time on an election we're sure to lose.

I second that motion. (0.00 / 0)


my summary of the comments is (0.00 / 0)
to the people in the district who worked for Adler, I wasn't harsh enough.


Frank LoBiondo Record and Jon Runyan Watch

don't sell this post short (4.00 / 1)
You were sufficiently harsh on professional democrats like Chairman Wiz....and just hard enough where adler's concerned.

Adler's government staff, his campaign staff and his opposition surely read this stuff religiously.  And when they do, they should see the Democratic base in NJ-3 letting out a big collective yawn.

activist for hire.Follow jay_lass on Twitter


[ Parent ]
Adler's Staff (4.00 / 1)
Why are they wasting time here?  They should be reading monster.com.

A big tent party (4.00 / 1)
has to allow people to disagree, even on very important issues.  And part of keeping that big tent open is letting people air out grievances.  

As a Democrat who couldn't support Jon Corzine, I can understand why someone feels that their basic values have been betrayed enough that they just can't vote for the lesser evil anymore.  I can't tell anyone how to vote.  I can only tell them that they have to live with whatever vote they cast.  


How are you living with your vote? (0.00 / 0)
It is unclear from your comment whether you voted for Corzine, Christie, Daggett, someone else, or did not cast a vote.

Regardless of how you voted, how are you feeling about that vote several months later?  If you had it to do again, would you have voted differently?

This is why I differentiate between supporting a candidate, which I define as contributing time, money, or some other resource to their campaign, and voting for a candidate.

Based on this differentiation, I can understand not supporting John Adler or Jon Corzine, but I cannot understand not voting for them.


[ Parent ]
I'm fine with it (0.00 / 0)
I voted for Daggett, and I'd do it again.  In all honesty, Corzine was either unable or unwilling to insist on any sort of ethical code, and that's as much a core value for me as housing and education.  So I don't particularly feel like either Corzine or Christie was a good fit for my vote.  There was a time when Corzine could have reached out to folks like me.  He just never did.

I don't know about Adler.  I'll probably give him my normal $20 donation.


[ Parent ]
Why? (0.00 / 0)
Someone like Ed Potosnak could use and probably deserves your $20 much more than John Adler and is no more of a longshot when you consider what turnout is going to be like this year.

I can appreciate your position on ethics, but I am not entirely sure that it is a luxury that anybody can afford, especially when there are just as many ethical and unethical people on both sides of the aisle.  While Corzine could and should have changed the culture of corruption that permeates our state, he either lacked the vision or the will or both to do what was necessary, but I seriously doubt that Daggett would have either if he would have miraculously won.

As much as I would prefer to live in a state where elected officials and party leaders were more ethical, I also know that I and most of the other residents of our state are not engaged enough in the day-to-day operations of our political parties and our government to the degree that would be needed for meaningful ethics reforms to not only be passed legislatively, but also executed.

You may feel that you do enough in this regard, and if that is the case, I commend you, but if not, I think that it is unreasonable and counterproductive to eschew the clear differences from a policy perspective between candidates like Christie and Corzine simply because you don't feel that Corzine did enough on the ethics front.

I would think being an educator yourself, the loss of hundreds, if not thousands of teaching jobs throughout the state as a result of Christie's policies would be enough reason for you to feel some degree of regret about casting the vote that you did.

I think that both you and I are in agreement about consolidating the administration of both education-related and non-education-related services at the county level, because we both know that this is the most efficient way to use scarce resources.

However, knowing the political culture of the state as we do, we also have to recognize that it is at the county level where the political machines, both Democratic and Republican, are the most muscular and by consolidating administrative power in this way, we would be feeding these unethical beasts with even more power that they will most likely use in even more unethical ways.

Recognizing this, I believe that the benefits of this kind of consolidation are greater than the costs of the corruption that they will undoubtably breed.  It is unfortunate that such trade-offs are part and parcel of the politics in our state, but until the voters do more than just vote, that is not going to change and I don't think that good policy ceases to be good policy just because it might create more opportunities for corrupt people to be even more corrupt.

In some respects, it is not unlike the recent healthcare reform legislation, which is despite all of its shortcomings good policy even though its greatest shortcoming is that in the short run it will greatly enrich the same private insurance companies that many of us would like to put out of business.

The perfect cannot be the enemy of the good, and while neither of us think that Chris Daggett is perfect, for whatever reason that you thought that he deserved your vote, he was the enemy of the good, or in Corzine's case, less bad alternative between Corzine and Christie, which were the only two real options that we had.

Did you also vote for Ralph Nader in 2000, because Al Gore wasn't a good fit for your vote.  Living in Texas or New Jersey at the time, I guess that a Nader vote probably didn't make a difference.

Then again, I voted for the Green Party candidate in 1997, because as bad as Christie Todd Whitman was on so many issues, she was willing to risk her office by vetoing a ban on late term abortions, because it didn't make exceptions for the health and life of the mother, and Jim McGreevey didn't say a word about the issue while "Libertarian" Murray Sabrin was bashing her for it and stealing conservative Republicans.

I guess that Corzine's failure to stand up for ethics is as much of a reason to not vote for him as McGreevey's failure to stand up for a woman's right to choose, but in a state like New Jersey, it is hard for me to equate the two.  But I guess that's why I held my nose and voted for Corzine and you didn't.

I guess that I should be able to understand how you can feel fine in the aftermath of last year's election to the same degree that I was able to feel fine with four more years of Christie Whitman, although I think that McGreevey's dreadful performance during his brief time in office redeems my vote better than Corzine's mediocre performance during his first term, but I just can't.  I guess that's more my problem than yours since you have never really cared much about my opinion about anything and still probably don't.


[ Parent ]
It's a calculated move (3.00 / 2)
And there is too much to get into here.  I'll try to keep it pithy.

First, Corzine's defense of Hudson County corruption disgusted me.  If you can't summarily dismiss someone who testifies in court that they assisted a human trafficking and slavery ring in gaining political cover; then you just aren't fit for any office.  Period.

Second, I knew that Chris Christie would face a Democratic majority in both Houses.  Before he can do much of anything, he'll have to get four Dems in the State Senate and eight in the Assembly to go along with him.  Now, it isn't impossible to get a dozen Democrats to do just about anything, but it's enough that it should blunt the worst actions.

Third, I don't think there is any chance of reforming the Democratic Party as long as they have a lock on power.  Having been woken up, it is possible they will be desperate enough to pay attention to good government advocates and progressive policy gadflies.  

Finally, it is incorrect to say that I don't care what you, or others think.  I'm not so stuck on my superiority to believe that I know better than everyone else all the time.  And everyone needs people they respect to hold their feet to the fire from time to time.  However, it is my face I look at in the mirror and it is to me that my children look to see my values put into action.  So, ultimately, it is my conscience that I must listen to most closely.

Finally, I am sorry that anyone has to lose a job, whether they are educators or not.  However, we must live within our means, and that is something New Jersey hasn't done in a long time.  To get back where we need to be, there is going to be some pain.  I don't agree with much of what Christie is doing, and less with how he is doing it, but he is, at least, attempting some meaningful cuts.  I have faith that the Democratic majority, and time, will find a way to come out the other side of our budget crisis with a better school system.  At least, as a parent and educator, I hope and pray for that outcome.


[ Parent ]
How do you define "living within our means"? (0.00 / 0)
I could appreciate and understand everything that you wrote above, even if I don't necessarily agree with them, except your last point.

Aside from their collective unwillingness to abandon home rule and whatever percentage of spending you want to attribute to corruption, I am not aware of too many municipalities, school districts, counties, or the state as a whole for that matter that is operating extravagantly or proving services that anyone could describe as an unnecessary luxury.

Yes, we have the highest property taxes in the country, but is that based on dramatically higher per capita spending on public services than other states or an overreliance on the most regressive form of taxation available to our government?

Whatever Christie is doing that we may agree or disagree with, two things that neither he nor Corzine are addressing or have addressed are the costs of home rule and the overreliance on property taxes.  If anything, Christie is doing the opposite.  While his cuts at the state level will result in some cuts at the local, more than anything, they will result in higher property taxes, higher tuition, higher commuting expenses.

The only thing that is being reduced as a result of Christie's cuts are income taxes on NJ's wealthiest residents.  And you can look at the Democratic legislature as our only hope to fight against Christie's spending and tax cuts, but considering how often they have failed us in the past, do you really think that they are going to surprise us now?  You can hope and pray for that outcome as much as you want, but when was the last time that worked?

Reasonable people can disagree about whether it makes sense for us to have faith in God, but only the most deluded person can have any faith in the Democrats in Trenton.  As mediocre a Governor as Corzine was, he was still a greater force for progressive change than the legislature, which isn't saying much, I know, but there was still a discernible difference.

Finally, I never said that I didn't think that you didn't care about what anybody thinks nor did I say that I thought that you had some kind of superiority complex.  My comment was meant to be very specific about what you think about me and my opinions.


[ Parent ]
Really? (0.00 / 0)
Adler's decision to vote against healthcare is in no way a betrayal to Democrats or his district.  Healthcare passed by 7 votes in the house.  I find it very hard to believe that if his vote had been a make or break vote for the bill that he would have voted against it.  This was purely a political move that made ALOT of sense.

Adler is in a conservative district and with the current political climate he could not afford to vote for the bill unless it was absolutely necessary.  It would not be worth it at all for him to vote for the bill and have that cost him his seat in November.  Republicans are going to have large gains in November and the last thing we need is for him to lose his seat because he voted for a bill that he didn't need to vote in favor of.  It wouldn't be practical for him to give up his seat based purely on idealism.  I truly believe that if he had absolutely needed to.  I think it is being very short-sighted to consider this a betrayal if his vote of No causes him to be reelected.


I disagree with everything you said (0.00 / 0)
as you know from the post above.

0. He and Obama won election promising health care reform.

1. Both times he announced a no vote when leaders will still looking for yes votes. See Stupak negotiations. Democrats in much more Republican districts votes yes. In short, thinking he was a secret yes is wrong in my opinion.

2. I don't think a yes vote would hurt him. Already NJ polls show a significant positive swing towards the bill.

3. His no vote reinforced every negative conservative message on a core principle.

4. As I said above, while (as you say) this vote turned out okay despite Adler, he's now shown he will vote with any right-wing nut cause when he's afraid. So, when we next face a Bush-like or Cheney-like President, Adler is likely to be voting with him not against him.

Sure, I'd rather have him than Runyan, but notice above that some people who worked hard for Adler don't feel that way. Better to try again with someone new in a Presidential year they think.

Frank LoBiondo Record and Jon Runyan Watch


[ Parent ]
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