More Budget Solutions: Charging State Workers for Air and Water

I support a statewide parking tax (0.00 / 0)

for all employees. Right now, free parking subsidizes auto commuting, the worst for the environment.

And I support congestion pricing, and a carbon tax. And a water tax and a tax on impervious surfaces to pay for stromwaer management.

People forget that a small garbage tax is what enabled NJ to deevlop a good recycling program.

Make the market work for the environment. Make CHristie walk the walk.

 

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by: Winston Smith @ Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 22:18:03 PM UTC

Absolutely charge for parking!! (4.00 / 1)

Any suburban office parking comparison is apples to oranges. It is hugely more expensive to provide parking facilities in an urban environment.  Trenton will never be able to attract new private employers downtown if state workers suck up all of the parking. Even if a private firm wanted to offer free parking to their employees, there is not enough available.  With parking provided free to state workers, they have is no incentive to car pool, to take mass transit. The policy of taxpayer funded free parking needs to change yesterday!

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by: ConnectingDots @ Fri Mar 12, 2010 at 22:41:12 PM UTC

I pay for parking.... (0.00 / 0)

.....all the time, even when i am at work.  And a parking fee is a good way to get people to carpool and generally drive less.

State workers need to put on their big girl panties and stop bitching about things like free parking or the only allies they'll have left is one another.

activist for hire.

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by: Jay Lassiter @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 14:25:41 PM UTC

Public transportation (0.00 / 0)

When we're doing better thinking for, and properly funding, public transportation, I'll agree with this more than I do today.

It's not a particularly snappy signature, but here's what I think we need in the next NJ Democratic State Chair.  

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by: Rosi Efthim @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 15:12:11 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

incentive (0.00 / 0)

i think the better thinking and funding for mass trans won't come until people have an incentive to do so.  And so long and the people who work in Trenton have this incentive to drive to work it's no wonder we are in a negative loop on this one.  It's sad.

But Rosi's right.  Many of us have NO practical Mass trans options.  But many don't have paid-for parking at work either.

activist for hire.

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by: Jay Lassiter @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 15:51:18 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Paid Parking (0.00 / 0)

The state does not pay for worker's parking.  The state has unused lots in which people can park.   It's a different issue.  If the state spends money to build a parking garage, it's fair for people to pay to park in them.  

By your logic, the state has every right to start charging workers for the water they drink in the state buildings or for using the bathrooms.  Is this really the path you want to see NJ going down?

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by: princetonblue @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 18:59:01 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

You work? n/t (0.00 / 0)

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by: SmartyJones @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 17:18:13 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

is this... (0.00 / 0)

...addressed to me, PB?

activist for hire.

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by: Jay Lassiter @ Sun Mar 14, 2010 at 14:00:15 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

ZZZZZZ n/t (0.00 / 0)

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by: SmartyJones @ Sun Mar 14, 2010 at 14:17:32 PM UTC

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Inappropriate Comment (0.00 / 0)

"State workers need to put on their big girl panties and stop bitching about things"

It's completely inappropriate (and amazing for BJ) for any posting to contain comments that are both homophobic and/or misogynistic.  

Can't we talk about parking civilly?  

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by: princetonblue @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 18:54:40 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Connect these dots (0.00 / 0)

Urban locations have density to support public transit. CHrisite is slashing budgets for that.

Are you suggesting that the private sector is not investing in Trenton due to a lack of parking? Give me a break.

WHen those corporate subsidized workers out in the office parks in the suburbs pay for parking, then state workers should too.

Jay Lass - attacking state workers is not the solution to the problem - the economic problem we face were caused by the private sector -0 corproate greed. So, please, get a correct analysis of the problem before you shoot your mouth off about girly panties you macho man.

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by: Winston Smith @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 15:50:58 PM UTC

zzzzzz (2.00 / 1)

Winston, i'll fight for a state worker's right to get paid time off to have a baby.  But not for them to park for free.

activist for hire.

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by: Jay Lassiter @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 15:53:34 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

lack of parking IS a factor, Win (4.00 / 1)

during the day there's very little parking available. After dark, there's the eternal fear of Trenton's scary reputation ... if you had a business that could do the bulk of its retail during the day, they wouldn't pick Trenton even with the captive state worker audience as daytime traffic is just not enough to sustain most retailers, and that lack of traffic is directly linked to parking woes. Anyone who knows Trenton knows that driving downtown during the day is an exercise in futility unless you're prepared to walk a fair distance. Shoppers generally aren't. NIghts are another matter. Plenty of parking after the state workers leave ...

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 17:12:34 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

so is free parking in the contract? (0.00 / 0)

(I know it is at the state colleges.) In other words, is this something Christie has to negotiate?  

Frank LoBiondo Record and Jon Runyan Watch

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by: Hopeful @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 16:07:16 PM UTC

Parking in Trenton (0.00 / 0)

Something previous commenters apparently don't understand about Trenton is that a) downtown parking is at a tremendous premium during working hours, believe it or not  (see: http://www.trenton-downtown.co... there wouldn't be so many pay-to-park decks if parking were freely available) - and b) the parking areas surrounding the Justice complex are slated to be redeveloped (see http://www.state.nj.us/ccrc/ ).

Christie, who is doubtlessly aware of the former, is doubtlessly anticipating the latter. If the state is forced to build parking decks somewhere outside the downtown (it won't be on the land where they park now, the City is clear about that - it's all part of the master plan to reclaim downtown) and bus workers in - which they do now, as there is NO PARKING during the workday, it is truly impossible - then charging state workers something for the privilege may be necessary.

I like the carrot-stick approach, though - give a discount on NJTransit if they choose not to drive to work.

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 17:05:49 PM UTC

Trenton CCRC's essay on the Rt. 29 Corridor (0.00 / 0)

This is what is planned for the acres of parking that will be going away (maybe ... eventually ... )

http://www.state.nj.us/ccrc/do...

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 17:26:41 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Hey Everyone: It was supposed to be humorous! (0.00 / 0)

But there are a few serious points that come up.

1.   It is not easy to get to downtown Trenton by public transportation.  

2.  The big lots by baseball stadium are only used by state workers during the day, so it's not like anyone else is fighting for the right to park there.  What we have there is a captive audience that can be charged whatever the employer's whim decides.

3.  I like parking fees in general and taxes on car transportation.  It's good public policy.  I don't see that this is Christie's motivation.   I think Christie is looking to scapegoat state workers whereever he can.

4.  I know other non-state workers have a hard time understanding this, but a state job is not exactly a bed of roses.   It's not like if you are a lawyer and there are many firms doing the same type of work.   If you are in the civil service, you have about 49 other employers in the entire country (the other states), so for many tasks (such as the ones in Trenton), it is very difficult to change jobs when working conditions become unsatisfactory.  If you want a good civil service, there are reasons why you don't want the employer here (NJ State) to be able to make arbitrary decisions about things like parking.   Yes, we have jobs, and in this economic climate, we're lucky to have them, but that still doesn't mean we should be the first in line to balance NJ's budget.

5.  I'm unaware of any downtown Trenton redevelopment projects.  If that's the reason behind this, then it might make some sense.  But it certainly wasn't presented this way, so I'm loathe to believe that it was the cause.

 

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by: princetonblue @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 18:48:22 PM UTC

To your points (0.00 / 0)

1.   It is not easy to get to downtown Trenton by public transportation.  

Neither is it impossible. A reasonably healthy person can walk from the main NJTransit train station to any point downtown. Access via rail and light rail from Camden, Philadelphia, NYC and point in between go directly to the main station; and portions of Philadelphia and Bucks can access downtown via the West Trenton station. Both train stations are served by NJTransit buses, which provide connections to downtown and have routes that extend out to Princeton and well into Hamilton.  (see http://www.njtransit.com/sf/sf... ) In the city, cabs are also available.

2.  The big lots by baseball stadium are only used by state workers during the day, so it's not like anyone else is fighting for the right to park there.

That's true - except of course they are also used by the businesses in those blue office buildings, too - but those are not the lots that are going away. And there are others throughout and around the city, because there isn't enough parking close in to the downtown state office buildings now, and much of what there is is going away. The parking situation will only worsen when the downtown redevelopment eliminates the "ocean" of parking lots around the Justice complex north towards the State House.

3.  I like parking fees in general and taxes on car transportation.  It's good public policy.  

So do I. We agree. And if the state has to build new decks and can't pay for them, who should pay? (Hint: The correct answer is, "the users" ... )

4.  I know other non-state workers have a hard time understanding this, but a state job is not exactly a bed of roses.

Cue violins. Also, I assume that all state workers have valuable skills that would transfer to the private section, n'es pas? They aren't limited by law to only ever working for another state? Actually, it is EXACTLY like you're a lawyer and are doing work that other firms do, too. If your civil service job is so specialized that you cannot ever work anywhere else, you'd be doing youself and your family a service by getting the hell out of such a dead end.

In the end, I doubt Christie will follow through on his threat, but your case against making state workers pay for parking largely comes down to special pleading - civil servants are DIFFERENT. No, they aren't. And if the only way they can get to work is to either take mass transit or pay the price of a parking space, Oh, well ...  Welcome to the real world. People who work in Manhattan either take the train or pay exorbitant parking rates, or they get a job outside the city. The state workers will adapt.

5.  I'm unaware of any downtown Trenton redevelopment projects.  If that's the reason behind this, then it might make some sense.  

I assume then that you either don't work in downtown Trenton or insulate yourself from local Trenton issues. You will find the CCRC master plan I linked to of interest. Those lots around the Justice center have been in the source of disputes between the city and the state since they first went in 'cause the state pays no taxes on them.  Six years ago when I moved to Trenton I was told, all that parking is going to be condos someday. It's not news.  

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by: denniscmcgrath @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 20:50:02 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Again, it's your government (1.00 / 1)

In response to your response to point 4, you can keep your violins.  No one is asking for pity, but if you actually want a government that works, one might want to think about how to get good people.   In the real world, bad companies go under.  But states can't (even if they go bankrupt), so one needs to think about how to treat people and not have a knee-jerk reaction about how the "real-world" works.  

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by: princetonblue @ Sat Mar 13, 2010 at 22:26:15 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Nice try (0.00 / 0)

you say this was supposed to be humeros but clearly comedy is NOT your forte', PB.

activist for hire.

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by: Jay Lassiter @ Sun Mar 14, 2010 at 13:59:40 PM UTC

[ Parent ]