The truth about Holloway’s Sand Hill motives

Some people are misrepresenting themselves and their interests in New Jersey’s Native American Tribes and as a result all N.J. Indian Tribes suffer.

 As a member of the Ramapough Lenape Nation, i’m compelled to respond to Carol H’s accusations and lies about the NJ Commission of Indian Affairs and about my Tribe. Before I start, I would like to say that this is not how intertribal business should be conducted but because Carol H insists on using this vehicle, I will respond here. The main focus of concern should not be about Ramapough or the Commission but rather about Ron Stacy (ie Holloway) and his claim to be Sand Hill. How our Tribe operates should be of no concern to anyone, especially if you are not claiming to be Ramapough. It seems Carol H is trying to deflect the focus from Holloway’s claims so people won’t question his.

 Back when “Lone Bear” Reavey helped to create the N.J. Commission of Indian Affairs. (yes Lone Bear, not anyone else!), he assisted the Ramapough with research about our history which resulted in a seat on the Commission. Even though Lone Bear was a major player, he didn’t assign a seat to the Sand Hill directly but instead to the Intertribal group. Why? For the same reason his name was “Lone Bear”, he was alone in his work. There were no Holloways working with him as Carol H wants you to believe.

 These people are scam artists. They may have some Native blood and who doesn’t in America but does that make you Sand Hill? There is a simple answer, NO! Were they raised Sand Hill? NO! Ronald Stacy (Holloway) was raised in California as Jewish. So how can he now claim Sand Hill when he was not raised as such?…

 Another lie Carol H is pushing is that the Sand Hill are Federally Recognized as unsupervised. This is a play on words! Any organization not recognized by the BIA is unsupervised. In otherwords, they are not Federally Recognized.

 Medicine Crow Holloway who spent 30 years in Australia, sold himself as a Shaman for profit. In our culture, anyone who has the special gift to be a Medicine Man would not advertise himself as such, and would not sell his services. This position could only be achieved by learning from another Medicine Man. Who in the Sand Hill taught you?…

  Finally I’d like to share this website made and maintained by Native Americans to expose frauds. Sam Beeler who is the last of the three people pushing this fraud is listed not once but 2x. He may have some Native blood but his dealings with other groups posing to be what they’re not makes you wonder about his motives.…

 Not good enough you may say? Then how about from the Federally Recognized Cherokee Tribe listing the Holloway/Beeler Sand Hill as frauds?

http://tribalrecognition.chero… Click on ‘Fradulent group List’.

 I’m not going to get into a flaming war with anyone over this and i’m calling anyone out by name. But since some people can post lies, i’m compelled to respond to them. The answers are all over the internet as to whom these people are. If they were genuine, then why do they need Carol H. or Liz the Lawyer to represent them? Why can’t they speak for themselves? I am Ramapough! I am a Tribal Member and I speak to defend my family. For everyone else, don’t take my word for it, look it up for yourself on the internet. There is a true Sand Hill Tribe in N.J. whose history they are trying to steal.

 The N.J. Indians allowed this to happen. If we had been better organized and pushed harder for our recognition, people such as this wouldn’t have gotten a toehold in this state and made frivolous lawsuits wasting taxpayer money and time. We all need to band together as one and finally be recognized. The State of New Jersey is also to blame for dragging their feet about our Recognition. The evidence has been presented and it’s time for the State to accept it’s part in our plight and make things right. We can work together to make things better for all citizens.

Comments (36)

  1. carolh

    This diary is nothing but a pack of lies perpetuated by someone whose “tribe”  – the Ramapough – has repeatedly been rejected by the BIA because they are not a real Tribe.  

    For the criteria which must be met – and which the Ramapough DO NOT MEET but which the Sand Hill DO:

    In 1949, the Smithsonian listed the Sand Hill as the ONLY indigenous tribe in NJ that survived intact to the present time.

    One of the Ramapough members has even created fake Wikipedia pages about both the Ramapough and the Sand Hill and has been  scouring the internet and legally threatening anyone with something nice to say about the SandHill tribe led by Chief Holloway    

  2. Rosi Efthim

    So, we have a diary here – like some on this topic that have come before – where claims made here are refuted by the other side.

    And now there are 17 comments, with only 2 people going back and forth. Have you folks considered meeting for coffee and hashing this out? I’m not sure this is constructive.

  3. Nick Lento

    I don’t believe I’ve ever met you.   I have met many of the people who are on the other side of your assertions…..and I find them to be credible and of good character.

    As you know, many of the matters you are railing about are now before the courts.

    Chief Holloway is doing all in his power to bring these issues to an open public hearing at which people, perhaps even you, may be called to testify under oath…under penalty of perjury should you (or they) be exposed as lying.

    It is my deepest wish to see this come to an open hearing where all of these “facts” can be adjudicated under the force of law.

    My sense is that the state of New Jersey and the folks behind you are desperate to squash the suite before it comes before a judge in an open hearing.

    My sense is that if you were so 100% certain of the validity your “facts” that you would have invited the hearing and not tried every means possible to suppress it.  

    The likelihood that the State of New Jersey may be collectively (the various counties have also hired attorneys as I recall) spending MILLIONS OF DOLLARS desperately trying to keep this matter from coming to an open hearing speaks volumes.  If there was no merit at all they would have let it go through a trial and the allegedly merit-less claims would be thoroughly exposed as such.

    Please join with me, Pontiton I challenge you,  in my call for all of these matters to be heard in open court.    I eagerly await seeing all of the parties to this matter being examined and cross examined under oath.  Surely, Pontiton,  you will join me in that wish!

    May the new year bring truth to light and justice for all!!!

  4. pontiton (Post author)

    You are again deflecting the issue from Holloway and not answering the questions. Once again.. this is not about the Ramapough. Let’s address the Smithsonian comment. The Sand hill they were talking about was the group in Monmouth, not your supposed group.… Tell me how someone raised Jewish can now claim to be an Sand Hill?  He’s as much “Sand Hill” as I am Irish! You insult everyone’s intelligence by posting your misinformation.

    Let’s stick to the facts. Printing lots of paper that doesn’t say anything as to whom they are related to in the Sand Hill makes it impossible to believe you.

  5. pontiton (Post author)

    what do you consider a “pack of lies”? All the websites I posted that state Stacy is a fake? You are delusional! Here’s more right from the CNO!

    Greetings —

    The Cherokee Nation is overwhelmed with those charlatans who fraudulently claim to be shaman, spiritual leaders or descendents of a Cherokee princess.

    Such individuals make such claims without ever having lived within the Cherokee communities. They claim to be descended from some nebulous and mysterious ancestor who was from “a reservation in North Carolina” (there is only one) or “a reservation in Oklahoma” (there are none). The ancestor is never just a plain ordinary everyday Cherokee citizen but a “Cherokee Princess,” a “Cherokee Shaman,” or a “Cherokee Pipe carrier” none of which actually exist or ever have. Those who claim to be “shaman” do not reside within the known boundaries of the Cherokee Nation in Oklahoma.

    Cherokee medicine people and spiritual leaders are known to the Cherokee people and do not practice medicine for a fee nor sell “shamanic” lessons to anyone. They do not advertise their services through any form of media and certainly not over the internet.

    Traditional Cherokee healers and spiritual leaders provide their services to the Cherokee people. A Cherokee medicine person or spiritual leader is fluent in the Cherokee language and would conduct any medical or spiritual practices by using the Cherokee language. Therefore, our medicine people are those who were born of a Cherokee mother and a Cherokee father and would have been reared within a Cherokee community speaking the Cherokee language. Our traditional Cherokee healers and spiritual leaders are humble people and would not present themselves as such nor “hang out a shingle” so to speak.

    Cherokee medicine people are acknowledged and recognized by members of the Cherokee community as effective healers and leaders. It is the recognition of the Cherokee people that validates these persons as medicine people and healers not self-proclaimation. We may provide them small gifts, a token amount of money or foodstuffs in payment for their services. They do not charge for their services nor would they withhold their services when asked and they certainly would not prescibe payment by credit card.

    Cherokee medicine people may provide services to recognized members of other tribes or may provide services to non-Indians who would seek them out for treatment, but certainly would not mix their spirituality or medicine with that of other nations.

    Cherokee medicine and spiritual practices do not include tarot cards, palmistry, psychic readings or sweatlodge ceremonies.

    One may assume that anyone claiming to be a Cherokee “shaman, spiritual healer, or pipe-carrier,” is equivalent to a modern day medicine show and snake-oil vendor.

    You have my permission to print this response as is.

      Richard L. Allen. EdD

      Research & Policy Analyst

      Cherokee Nation

      P.O. Box 948

      Tahlequah, Oklahoma 74465

    Medicine Crow was doing just this thing for 30 years in Australia. How do you explain this?

  6. carolh

    Judaism is a religion, not a race.  Practicing Judaism, Islam or Christianity does not erase your family history or DNA.  

    Many Indians throughout history who were shown kindness by the Christian missionaries converted. That did NOT make them any less Indian.

  7. carolh

    the tribe RELOCATED from the Monmouth area around 1920 – Nearly a century ago. Your Monmouth friends are lying to you.

  8. pontiton (Post author)

    Being raised Native and converting to Christian is a big difference from being raised Jewish and converting to Native. No tribe would ever elect this person a “Chief”.. Oh wait..

  9. pontiton (Post author)

    How can that be when they are on the same land? AND they have the genealogy to prove it? Your friends have been lying to EVERYONE!

  10. carolh

    aren’t they?  The truth is, Medicine Crow is descended from Lenape blood chiefs. He has the DNA to prove it. Your take is quite hilarious considering that on the red road, rumor has it that your own Chief Perry has been getting advice from not only Mohawk folks but a Kaballah advisor, someone who might be offended by your view of Judaism.

    Blood makes the Indian, continuous autonomous indigenous sovereign government makes the TRIBE. Religion is something else entirely.  Until 1976, Indians were not allowed to practice their own – they often converted due to the immense pressure in the US to do so.  Not understanding that makes me question your sources.

  11. carolh

    Why is it impossible to be raised BOTH?  Your own “tribe” allowed folks to bring their respective Tuscarora, Dutch or African traditions into their group.

  12. pontiton (Post author)

    He was in California, 3000 miles away from the nearest Sand Hill member, how could he have learned anything?

  13. pontiton (Post author)

    Stick to the subject..  and “rumor” is just that .. RUMOR.. no fact! Also the AIRFA act was 1978, NOT 1976. You can question all you want but it has no bearing with the facts..  Blood and TRADITIONS makes anyone what they are.. He is not a Native despite what YOU believe.

  14. pontiton (Post author)

    how does he know he is the blood descendant of a Lenape blood chief? There is NO known DNA test to prove or disprove this.. TRY again..

  15. carolh

    family “photographs”.  That hardly constitutes proof of continuous tribal governance.  

    The tribe moved away from Monmouth but stayed in NJ according to the Smithsonian. Individual members of any Indian tribe can live anywhere – even Australia if they choose.

    What matters is where the TRIBE is located, not one lady who claims she is a tribe unto herself.

  16. carolh

    So, Perry ISN’T getting advice from other tribes and religious advisers that aren’t even Lenape?

  17. pontiton (Post author)

    The subject here is Sand Hill NOT Ramapough!  What my does or doesn’t do is no concern here.. You promoting a fake wannabe tribe and lying to NJ citizens is the only topic i’m discussing here..  

  18. carolh

    want to know is how YOUR folks wound up on the Indian Commission when the BIA wouldn’t even recognize you.

    You talk of proof but have NONE yourselves.

  19. pontiton (Post author)

    why not ask Lone Bear Reavey? Tell me what kind of DNA test it was?  Certainly not Matrilinear because his mother was Jewish..

  20. carolh

    only a Ramapough is allowed to discuss Ramapough issues when you want to spend all day TRASHING the Sand Hill – who have done NOTHING to you.  

    Your high minded talk of “tribal matters” being discussed behind closed doors is absurd when Ramapough members are making trash pages on Wikipedia about the Sand Hill and legally threatening me and other bloggers who write about this case. The behavior of members of your “tribe” has been nothing short of atrocious.

  21. carolh

    You still don’t want to share your geneology.  I have blogged ad nasueum about the DNA tests, I’m waiting for an answer as to HOW your folks ended up on the Commission.

  22. carolh

    The other is just lying through their teeth.  Coffee ain’t gonna solve this one.  But I’ll end it here.

  23. pontiton (Post author)

    Lies and trash our tribe and it goes on unquestioned? Last I remember this country was based on Democracy. I have a right to respond to her allagations and ask for proof..

  24. pontiton (Post author)

    I’m sure I could get Claire’s support if i needed it. I’m stating and posting facts about your “wannape” friends.. You can’t dispute the facts. AND you have alot of nerve.. you have consistantly bashed on the Ramapough in every blog you have made.. The time for this is over.. you wanted a debate? Well now you have it..  

  25. pontiton (Post author)

    We only threaten your perceived vision of truth..

  26. pontiton (Post author)

    I’m still waiting to see some proof…

  27. pontiton (Post author)

    Lone Bear assisted us in our history many years ago and added us to the Commission.. So now what do you have to say? Didn’t you know this? There’s alot more you don’t know too!!!

  28. pontiton (Post author)

    Claire has whole family there. There are many more than just one person you insult with your lies.  

  29. pontiton (Post author)

    The longer you keep talking, the more people will see what scam artists they are…

  30. Rosi Efthim

    You have a right to post here, and you have. CarolH has that right also, and she has also posted here. You both have posted things, and been refuted by one another.

    It’s very difficult for the rest of us to unscramble any of this. Particularly since there is so much vitriol, accusation, and charges of lying, I think most of our readers are skipping over all of it. No offense is meant, because I know this is very important to some of the posters on this subject. But I’m not sure how much light is being shed for the rest of us.  

  31. pontiton (Post author)

    I am posting facts with links from reliable sources such as the Federally Recognized Cherokee Nation and links these posers have created themselves. I want everyone to see exactly who these people are and what they represent. For months Carol has done nothing but bash my tribe because we recognize the Monmouth Sand Hill. This is our decision and our right as a Native American Tribe in New Jersey. Why is Carol allowed to write trash about the Ramapough and our Chief and not stick to the subject? It would be very easy to settle all of this. Let both Sand Hill groups get together and work it out (without outside influences)  Claire Garland has the genealogy and birth certificates to prove their claim. Stacy does not and this is why he has Carol running interference.  

     By the way.. i’m glad you said i’m allowed the right to post here because when I tried to make comments on Carol’s blog, i’m not allowed. I also tried to register under ramapoughnative and was denied. Funny huh?

  32. pontiton (Post author)

    there are many more than 2 people involved with this blog. Many, many people are reading this. I have the emails to prove it..

  33. pontiton (Post author)

    There are many more people reading this than you think. I have posted facts with supporting links from the Federally Recognized Cherokee and even some of their own URL’s. Carol has given nothing but accusations supported by their own paperwork. Either she is misguided or brainwashed. In either case, the Ramapough have nothing to do with recognition, yet she continues to bash us. Stacy knows what he needs to do to retify this. Get with Claire Garland and work our your differences, then present your paperwork to the state, not the Commission

  34. Rosi Efthim

    I’m quoting you here:

    By the way.. i’m glad you said i’m allowed the right to post here because when I tried to make comments on Carol’s blog, i’m not allowed. I also tried to register under ramapoughnative and was denied. Funny huh?

    I had no idea what you were talking about there, so I just checked to see about a Blue Jersey account with username:  ramapoughnative

    Here is the account you said you were “denied”. Perhaps you had difficulty logging on, or forgot your password? I have no idea. It’s all automatic and I don’t know there’s a problem till I get an email, which I did not get. But seriously, please save your vitriol for each other and leave me and any other staff writer here out of your accusations.

  35. pontiton (Post author)

    Because I have never registered that name before.

  36. pontiton (Post author)

    I would welcome an open hearing on everything except here’s my terms.. When your friends are found out to be the frauds they are, they should be liable for all costs involved instead of the taxpayers and they should be jailed for fraud.. Since you and Carol are so adament on who you think they are, you should be held accountable too. Still wanna play Nick?


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